The new TopKarts are all built by Parolin. Top Kart sold their production equipment to EVO Kart years ago, and then the brand got bought by MondoKart to be sold as a house brand/margin play.
2 Likes
It’s an uphill battle in a market that doesn’t make the most sense financially. If one has the money to spend to make it happen, that money can be more effectively used to make more money with less risk and effort elsewhere.
There’s a whole list of reasons not to do it yourself in the US until you have the actual market share/production volume to justify moving it. One of the big ones is that very, very few americans actually possess a functional understanding of how the chassis works at the geometry/metallurgy level, so it makes far more sense to align yourself with a factory in europe that you can learn with or from until you’re confident enough to leave the nest.
As much as everyone thinks that karts are immensely profitable, they really aren’t, and the quantities that an upstart is going to move chassis in isn’t very impressive either.
Take Factory Kart for example. Musgrave was selling a TON of Mad Croc, Aluminos, etc before they made the switch to doing their own chassis. Now as far as I can tell they aren’t selling nearly the same amount of chassis, and are having to work a whole lot harder. Billy still does well on them, however the level of performance certainly hasn’t been what it once was. Sure, other factors could be at play here such as the Mad Croc/Aluminos/Praga scandals, and SKUSA effectively suffocating the shifter market to death with indecision and then a half baked 175. However GFC, and Magik seem to be coming out of that period strong, so there’s some comparison between the two routes, especially when you consider the fact that at their conception, MRC had a big following while Magik didn’t exist, and GFC wasn’t even being sold to anyone but a few close customers of Gary’s.
3 Likes
I was hoping you’d chime in!
Not sure I agree with the 175 being half baked. I think the concept (KZ level performance with lower maintenance cost) was worth taking a risk on, the problem of course is that it’s also very alien to everything else shifter.
Still though, I think it was ballsy of SKUSA to give it a go, even though they had a lot to lose.
1 Like
Just wait till Billy wins the SuperNats.
1 Like
I don’t know about the rest of the US, but the group of NW kart clubs won’t even allow the 175 on track. I wonder what kind of impact those kind of decisions has had on its adoption
100% massive impact for sure, that’s what I was hinting at when I said it wasn’t like it wasn’t like other shifters.
Priced significantly higher than the RoK probably didn’t help local/regional adoption either.
Some of that may be for safety reasons? I’d image you need a pretty big track to get a 175 revved out, and maybe their isn’t enough real estate at certain tracks and they don’t want to chance it for insurance reasons?
It seems like everyone up here has now switched to KZ for club racing so I’m not sure how much cost is a factor.
I thought the idea of the 175 was that the torque didn’t require it to have to rev out. But I’ve never driven one let alone see one in person so I could be wrong.
I could be wrong. We have 3 new 175’s at my local, and one of the track workers was saying our 1.1 mile track was on the small side for a 175, then he started talking about safety and insurance concerns; hence why it made me think about it. But like I said, I’m just repeating what I heard. Have no idea if its accurate.
There’s a dose of irony there alright.
250cc two strokes run on tiny ovals in unlimited classes, so you can still get some speed out of a 175 on a sprint track.
1 Like
I think the supernats track is < 1 mile 
175 performance on par with a 125 so I’m not sure where the insurance or safety concerns would be exactly. Sure it’s torqier, but it’s not demonstrably faster than a typical shifter.
In my experience, “insurance concerns” to be used as a bit of a cop out for things people just don’t want to deal with.
Some sprint tracks have open/unlimited classes that allow 250cc engines, insured by the likes of WKA.
2 Likes
The 175 shouldn’t be any faster than the 125 shifters. If they’re saying the 175’s are too fast for the track, I would assume all the shifters are too fast. The speed certainly isn’t a reason why the 175 didn’t pan out.
2 Likes
It takes just as long to wind out the KZ as the 175. That’s a ridiculous excuse for not allowing them. The performance and lap times are on par with each other but the KZ just flat races better which gives it the minute edge on the 175.
Whoever is saying the tracks are too small is clueless.
2 Likes
I wouldn’t say he’s incapable of it by any means, he’s an excellent driver. However I have a hard time betting against the factory TM’s. Fat Franco has basically picked the winners and losers for a number of years after the fall of Tec-Sav and Tony Kart removing their factory presence.
1 Like
I have a hard time betting against Billy at SuperNats…
1 Like
I’m partial to Danny Formal and Max Paul. Obviously Danny has had just as much success at Vegas as Billy, but Max showed up in 2019 too. I might be a little biased from my DR days but I can see both of them running super well
My comment about indecision is largely based on the fact that many people were selling off Hondas prematurely before SKUSA even made a decision on the successor to the Honda platform in the years after the IAME distributorship changed to SKUSA. People saw the writing on the wall, sold, and then had to buy something when they realized what they were predicting wasn’t coming as soon as the market expected.
Many went Rok, and those who did, didn’t want to buy a 175 when they saw the price and the teething issues the early engines were having. That snowballed into low entry counts, and FUD preventing further adoption. Then came the carb change, which galvanized many of those who felt the package wasn’t “done” when it was released.
Furthermore, the adoption of KZ into the class and subsequent rapid return to form, went to show that people wanted to race with SKUSA, just not if it required purchasing an engine that wasn’t widely accepted elsewhere.
The original concept of the 175 was to increase the displacement (after all, “there’s no replacement for displacement”) which would boost the power output for the relative strain on the engine and result in better reliability. A lot of people made a big deal about power early on, however there’s no real effective way to make use of it on the same tire compound.
I agree. After the Honda CR80 intro to karting, that is the direction I wanted to go (175). The only thing it was missing was a starter. The price was right, the engineering seemed solid - BUT - the local clubs wouldn’t consider it. Mutual loss IMHO.
I have an SSE 175 and have enjoyed the power and durability. One disadvantage is that with the pumper carburetor it’s a cold blooded and finicky engine to start on the stand and needs a very heavy push to start. This doesn’t compare well to a TM which can be started by putting it in second gear and kicking the bumper.
1 Like