To an extent I agree, but at the higher end of the sport (SKUSA/USPKS) it shouldn’t happen. The chances that the backmarkers who don’t have the same level of racecraft make a mistake that causes the leaders to slow down or shuffle order doesn’t seem right to me. Worse case it causes a crash and takes out the leaders.
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But there shouldn’t be noobs at a national race.
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Oh indeed. I’m just saying it’s fun. And it isn’t noobs necessarily. Perhaps a better word would be less experienced in racecraft. The ideal is not to have unpredictable slower guys. Packs within a big field, let’s say there’s a good race with 1-4 at similar pace working way through then 5-10 maybe running a tenth or two off, and so on, each group having to navigate the other groups racing their races. I was clear that this is rental racing perspective. Y’all do you, I understand that it’s more existential when it’s something pro, different expectations and rules. Just saying that for me, traffic is a feature, not a bug. Also, we can pretty much just move guys that are being clueless which is probably not tolerated in higher level stuff. They’ll presumably be removed from the playground (flagged off) once lapped or something in your races. Just seems less amusing to me, personally. But I don’t have any experience doing the big show type stuff so maybe it’s more fun than I think.
SCCA auto racing is 25 cars per mile. So a little over 200 ft per car. At June Sprint and Run Offs regularly start 60 to 70 Spec Miata cars
I think there are many layers to this discussion, as seen above.
It’s hard for Series to limit entries or limit the number of karts in a final because at the end of the day, they need entries to sustain their series, and you will lose entries as you lower the limit of karts on track.
In that same vein, not everyone at a national race is a national level driver. There are some kids who’s parents can afford it, and they like the arrive and drive method. Those are the parent’s who think their kid is on the driver development ladder, and they might be right depending on how deep their pockets are.
Driving standards are also a large issue with wrecks in large field. Too many drivers trying to gain multiple positions in turn 1.
As a spectator, the larger the better!
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hehe have you ever watched a NASCAR cup series race there’s noobs there. your not gonna get rid of them at the national level karting events. i find this lapped traffic conversation interesting.
50+ is fine for superkarts on a long circuit 
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100+ of any type of kart is fine for a long circuit.
Yes but a NASCAR race is what 2hr+? These are “sprint” races. You shouldn’t be battling lapped traffic in a 20lap race.
In Roadracing, multiple classes (and thus traffic) is the rule rather than the exception…can be fun.
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my point here is more that you have inexperienced racers in all forms of racing. top to bottom your not really gonna get rid of that
but since a NASCAR race is too long. How about a world of outlaws sprint car race. where people get lapped in 10 lap heats. Lapped traffic is a part of all racing. Because at the end of the day when it comes down to championships and points. when is it acceptable to say this pack of four guys at the back they dont deserve to be out there anymore.
This is where LCQ’s bring prestige to any event. and cutting the actual field size is ok in my option to do this. This bring the elite drivers to the feature. widdles out those that are too slow to make it. if you’ve earned the right to be in that feature IMO you have earned the right to be on that track all race lead lap or not.
so i guess in a nut shell i agree with smaller field sizes, but not necessarily with flagging people off the track. ( you can tell them to yield to leaders but you shouldn’t tell them to end there race.
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82 was my first year doing the GP!
I would rather see this done mathematically with x number of karts for every unit of measure. There seems to be a reluctance to have lettered mains like they do on dirt.
Would you rather finish last or near the back of A main of 40 karts or near the front in a B main of 20 karts? If there were bump-ups that would give some drivers more track time too.
For what it’s worth, MOST of these big national series do run LCQs. But if you take 40 karts to the final and there are like 45 entries, it doesn’t make a whole lot of sense to send 5 people home, so on occasion they run them all in the final.
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its tricky you don’t wanna send 5 people home but ya don’t wanna be forcing lapped traffic off either. At the end of the day the big boy series have rule set that i think as a driver or team you have to be willing to abide by sometimes. do I agree with a 50 kart field maybe not. do agree with sending 5 people home tho also probably not. I do not envy the promoters and rules makers as these are decisions where more then likely someone is gonna end up upset with how it works.
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Xander and I talked about this on a Happy Hour podcast ages ago, I can’t remember what brought it up. The real limiting factor, honestly, isn’t track length, it’s how much officials can see.
Once you get into the mid-30’s there becomes too many karts for the officials to actually see what’s going on. It turns race starts, and generally the entire race, into a lawless wild-west type of scenario. I’ve had a few times where I started in the back half of a field and knew I could get away with practically anything since there were too many karts for them to really catch me.
That’s why I like the 36 kart limit that FIA Karting events have. 36 is manageable with a good officiating crew. I think we should have a hard number and stick to it. If there are 37 entries, it’s a 5 kart shootout to keep your weekend alive, or just stop taking entries at 36.
I also do believe in keeping lapped karts off the track at the national level. If you’re going a lap down in a 20 lap race, either you should be more prepared before coming to a national event, or you had an issue and don’t need to be on the track anyways. I’ve seen too many issues with one national level series allowing lapped karts staying out on track and severely impacting races for the lead for me to see a good reason to let them stay on track. It’s the top level of the sport, there should be expectations about how good a driver is.
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It really depends on the level of the race, In any national race it adds absolutely nothing that the leaders will have lap slower karts, its not kindergarden if you are so slow that you are being lapped you ned to practise more.
Race results should not be alteret due to slower karts being lapped, and that have osten been the result.
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Having just completed our first season with TSRS in KA100 last year, we found ourselves in the back half of 40+ kart fields a couple times. Definitely not a proponent of fields that big here. Officials can’t or won’t officiate rough driving and it is far to easy to find yourself weaving through someone else’s mayhem. If you clear the mayhem you have gained a handful of quick and easy spots but are gapped from the lead pack with no hope of being relevant. If you don’t clear the mayhem you have a DNF and bent parts to replace. Really sucks if you screw a qualy and end up back there for 3 heats…
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I can confirm that from a officiating stand point. I saw it repeatedly at grands. I’d be focusing on a battle for the lead maybe back to 10th then someone in 25th gets nailed in the same corner but i cant even see which of the eight karts involved actually started it. that event has 60 karts start and I Understand why the field is that big. it does present a challenge for officials though.
I think this is a really smart way to think about this. I’d hate to be a corner worker with 30 karts let alone 50.