Newer Bodywork Types - Advantages?

My guess is that aero always matters as long as it’s balanced with other constraints like grip and top speed. In autocross you’ll see adjustable duckbill spoilers set nearly vertical to maximize aero grip on courses where speeds are all under 60mph. F1 is a more delicate balance given the need for high speed and aero grip.

Re: bicycles- The world hour record for bicycles like you posted is 55.x kph (34.x mph) while the world hour record for fully faired human powered vehicles is 91.x kph (56.x mph). That’s a greater than 50% increase in speed on aero alone. On top of that, the hpv rider is not as good an athlete as the upright bike record holder so the true difference is probably a few kph larger. The bodywork on an hpv is extreme, but does give a good example of the difference aero makes.

For karts: it would probably be difficult to build in a lot of aero grip unless karts became fully faired, which is probably undesirable from a cost perspective. Also, I believe slower classes can sometimes have too much grip. But again, I’m a noob and might be wrong there. Drag reduction or handling in dirty air are probably the best places to look for aero gains on a kart. Aero won’t let you outrun your gears but would let you get there a bit quicker. As for how much that’s worth? IDK, but testing would be fun.

I may have mentioned it in previous aero threads, but I swear I can feel aero understeer when following into the last corner at New Castle (70+ mph).

There was a previous thread on this and I recall you doing some testing there and not showing any advantages to the hot dog bun.

The newer style sidepods do allow more room for battery packs…

I’ll probably end up with something like that after I start with my cut-up fat ones.

Correct, no difference in lap time, RPM, or top speed in back-to-back testing at New Castle.

I think someone else noted in that thread that the new “aero fairings” are more to eliminate aero lift and turbulence in traffic, as Ronald is discussing above here.

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When the current pods first came out I swore I had aero understeer around a 5th gear corner in France when following someone in KZ (this was the CRG bodywork).

If you want to see a close to fully fared kart look for Number 1 with the yellow shoulders on his suit in this video.

This is at least the second time i posted this video lol.

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A reasonable take on aero for sprint racing is that there is likely some very small gains which make enough of difference to change a qualifying position (which itself makes aero improvements worthwhile), but in an actual race where positioning, strategy, and out-braking matter more than the absolute fastest theoretical speed, aero probably matters as much as what you ate for dinner three nights ago. It’s worth noting that the only place one sees the slippery aero bikes/outfits come out are during the individual time trial stages of bike races, in the group stages no one races those bikes or wears those outfits/helmets.

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I’m not saying he had an aero advantage, but he does just drive past everyone on the last lap (before being fired off on the last corner)

I’ve watched this video about a dozen times over the years I think. Manetti has lots of straight speed but zero friends. Such a crazy race.

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Thanks for the insights and explanation. Very interesting. :+1:

You guys were flying low.

is there conventional downforce on a kart? that would be the only reason for that. I wonder how we could measure it

Take all the pods off and back to back. That way you get a better baseline for whether the pods/panels have any measurable effect… at all.

Though to be honest I question the wisdom of a governing body that has effectively mandated aero development into a motorsport that absolutely doesn’t need it. I can’t think of a bigger waste of money… and plastic too. They were introduced for safety (apparently) … yet being exploited for aero benefit.

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I would be shocked if industry lobbied to have aero bodtwork mandated in order to push product. Shocked.

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I think you are missing the part about FIA/CIK wanting to level the playing field for all body types. A tall driver with big feat is at less of disadvantage with bodywork that can spike (Conical effect) the air prior to hitting his feet/helmet. (Cough M7) or a Wide Driver is at less of a disadvantage if you can push more of that air around the driver (Cough Dynamica) then if it was bodywork that didn’t push air around the driver. On your average 5ft 8inch 140lbs Karter your not going to see the same kind of gains.

Same Kart, Same seat Position, Same Driver… Look at how much more spike is on the new aero… Yes, the CD for a small karter might not have improved but for me its a big change.

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Head on like that, it does look significant.

Are the new aero required in all fields, or only ones with CIK regulations?

Also curious to know how much can aero effect the kart in a race. I’m assuming not much since everyone uses the same aero design in order to level the field

Senior OK is 145kg, 17-20kg lighter than standard senior weight. So I don’t think they are all that bothered by body types.

The bodywork is mandated for safety, not aero. But because you HAVE to run it, it then becomes aero devices hence why I said it’s ‘effectively mandated aero’. I have never seen anything from the CIK suggesting £170 number plates helps level the playing field for body types.

I am just getting old and fed up to be honest. :slight_smile:

Aaron you make some interesting points. Why is a round or cylindrical object so undesirable?

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I’m not an engineer so I won’t fumble through a technical explanation. The short answer is that air doesn’t flow smoothly around cylindrical shapes especially on the back side. When the air abruptly separates from the surface it causes turbulence and that’s aerodynamically slow.

Wings are fast shapes because they allow air to smoothly transition from being attached to detached from the surface.

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