Open/mix 100cc class does it work

Can you remember what HPV pipe that was?
3 ?

What numbers are we talking here with regard to entries. How does it all breakdown at your meetings?

Also, have to love the insanity of karting. Only us morons can create so much complexity out of bloody small capacity 2-stroke engines

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L or A series pipes, which are proper expansion chamber pipes, would make the KT a closer match.

The development of the KT is there over the years, and the parts are out there to where if you didn’t make one adhere to WKA spec it could easily run with the reed jet motors.

They can be built to be fast-ish alright. I’ve even seen stock appearing KT’s with reeds inside :joy:

I’m not sure if it would be worth the investment for many given the price of a new VLR which I suspect would have more longer service intervals at the same power level.

That’s why I’m thinking something that might be a reasonable hop-up cost. Machining a cylinder head to bring the head volume down for example.

We have 8-206 karts and 8-2 stroke karts. 4-kids. The 2 stroke class is 4 tag karts, 2 KT, 1 kpv, 1 ka. . Have a few guys looking at the ROK/ Ka

In Australia we can run KT Yamaha’s with KA 100’s at club level. KT’s aren’t sanctioned at State or National level any more.
KT’s with Australia’s “pipe” run 9 kg (19.8 Lbs) less then KA’s in all weight divisions. This, in my opinion is not enough of an advantage for the average KT. The “special” KT’s might be even or at an advantage at this weight but not the average ones. I would like to see maybe 10 - 15 kg’s (22 - 33 Lbs) at a minimum.
But that again is why we have moved away from the Yamaha, as there is such a huge difference between castings that it is very hard to get an even field.
I have seen a KT keep up with a KA and be about to pass with no reason for it to be able to. That was a fantastic engine which was bought for $10,000. Insanity.
KT’s will chug along both here and in the US for a few more years, but I feel that its time to wave them goodbye, sooner the better.

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If you only have 4 people then there must be a way to reach a consensus on what’s the best way forward with engine purchases and so on? You’re never going to find any kind of parity with 4 drivers. the numbers aren’t there to find a weight limit in each that has any kind of bop merit.

If this is for club level and Yamaha guys are having problems moving to a modern motor they just need to be convinced. I have the same issue with my local track I do t regularly race at any more. They will send two Yamaha motors and clutches off for a rebuild for 1500$ but aren’t to sure about buying a VLR for the same amount. Doesn’t make sense in my eyes.

We ran the 3 pipe until 2008 I believe. 2009 and onwards was the 4 pipe. Some tracks the 4 pipe wasn’t any faster, but on others it was worth a little time.

So while we’re small maybe implement a motor package . Suggest the Yamaha and kpv guys move to the new motor. If we do a KA100/VLR 100 class do y’all have a weight structure for those two engines running together ?

You’d probably be better off putting all you money on one of the two options. Otherwise it’s a pointless additional complexity and you’re at the whims of the manufacturers who at any point could implement ‘upgrades’ which would render your weight categories useless. Multi-manufacturer racing works fine when engine manufacturers are building to the same technical and regulatory specification. When they’re not it’s a bit of mine field. It can just about work if the customer base is fully aware that it’s a ‘open’ type format and they might be racing a doorstop or if it’s entry ‘just get out there’ level (TaG Restricted in Aus for example)

the tricky thing is really that your numbers are so low that in normal circumstances there’d be no club meeting at all. I presume your getting track rental for free? 1 guy turns up for the 100 class and they represent 20% of the class so you’ll naturally want to accommodate. It’s tricky percentages to work with when finding a solution

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Free track rent… Being low count we have normal guys who been coming and running there old motors for years and don’t want to switch. but we have neighbor tracks running KA100 and VLR. being the track is under new management and we want to grow. we think we would grow faster with the new motors but if we don’t get any new members or the other tracks to come we rely on are old members who run what you brung.

RoK USA offer combined KA and VLR 100cc classes at their RoK the Rio event. Last year a KA won, but it’s was nip and tuck really and would be even less of a factor at club level.

I believe Vortex made a slight tweak to the rules this year on ignition timing to bring it closer to the KA. We’re talking a tenth or two though from what I understand.

Weight is 350lbs for senior and 380lbs for masters. Same weight for both engines in each class.

There’s very little difference between them in performance honestly and are of equal engineering/mechanical quality.

How long to IAME decide they don’t want to be subsidise VLR grids? There’s no guarantee they won’t introduce some kind of update that renders the VLR non-competitive. Just seems like an unstable platform to me.

My club runs VLR and KA side by side. No issues, no difference in weight and they are competitive next to each other. At Sr. And masters weight. Run them together. It lets people get into a modern motor at half the price as a KA. I would have bought a KA except that I want to run some skusa events next year. There is no reason to buy a ka if your club runs them together and you do not plan on running any Skusa sanctioned races.

I would say that IAME is the bigger motor across the country compared to the VLR. SKUSA, USPKS, and WKA all use a KA100 package. It really depends on what you’re looking to do with karting. Staying at a club level should be fine with a VLR, but your options are a little limited if you want to move into a higher level series.

@Alan_Dove interesting question. I kinda figured that IAME just saw it as extra motor sales at the minimum. With their deals with USPKS, WKA, and SKUSA they sell a good number of engines already, and if anyone wanted to run ROK Cup they have the option of getting a KA to compete as well. I didn’t think they were losing any engines by ROK Cup allowing the KA100 in the 100cc class.

Also, I do believe the KA is still marginally quicker than the VLR with the timing adjustment, or at least looking at the local club around here that runs both the KA seems to be a tad bit quicker still.

Just a slight note, it’s not half the price as a KA. The VLR package retails for $1695 and the KA for $2395.

Definitely a risk of a war of arms happening… just like 125cc TaG. Maybe we’ll learn from our mistakes…
There are some rule freezes in place, so that’s a thing.

There is a possibility of a positive sum game for both parties, but long term Vortex and IAME are in direct competition with each other (though I would guess closer to each other than say they are with BRP).

ROK Cup allowing KA100 engines is in the hope to take those drivers from IAME and subsidise their own grids. I don’t think long term allowed KA into the class will be on the agenda. Could be wrong of course, I have been many times.

TJ, your right. I was a bit exaggerated with the half price comment. It’s closer to under 1k by the time you add a cheap battery and weld a bung on if that’s what you want.