PFI closing complex - KartKraft

You are welcome. I recommend trying. If not, screens are just as “fast” if not “faster”. But imo vr is “better”.

The only issue with VR is that i do a lot of it such that when I get into my actual car, it feels “floaty” and simlike. I quickly readjust but there is that.

Then don’t use VR in your car then :wink:

Ha! I deserved that!

I meant mechanically! I cannot speak to the effects of beer but I imagine that a one beer buzz would likely make your brain more receptive.

Edit: Edited the top part now that I have some more laps under my belt.

I know you can’t experience what VR feels like from a video but here’s an eventful VR race I lost. There’s a bunch of passing, bumping and crashing. Now imagine instead of this being a video that you were seeing this through my eyes; that kart next to me as I dive alongside him through the final turn and we run sidepod to sidepod all the way to bridge, where he chickens out… Gripping stuff in VR. You gotta try it!

Yeah I saw that! I’m following you on Youtube now. Shall I just come over and test it with you? I live only about 6,000 miles away :wink:

No seriously, I don’t have any hardware at the moment. It’ll be quite an investment to get all the proper stuff, not just the VR. I’m not sure if it’s worth it, I’m not sure if I’ll be hooked.

Just re-watched that footage. Its amazing how the feel of the game feels very similar to your pace and rythym. Very cool thanks! Also, nice driving, very together.

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Sure. Mi casa es su casa!

Hmmm. Just reread this now that I am much faster through here.

There’s some good info here but I’d explain differently now. You can’t hold the inside striped line at the bottom, you have to take the kart in lower.

Also, all the lifts aren’t necessary but can be very handy when you get bent out of shape in there.

Clip the apex of the fast right leading into the straight before the complex. Accelerate hard down left side. Keep accelerating and lift just past the dotted lines. It’ll feel like you are holding throttle too long.

Once you turn in, allow the kart’s momentum to bleed left and lower. If you do this right, you’ll be in the rubber. Use that rubber as your backstop. You will feel the tires gripping the rubber on the track.

Watch for the opening above you. Eyes up, don’t get lost in the turn.

As you loop right, into the initial turn into toilet bowl, you will likely need to start back into throttle. Careful because you will need to immediately loop left. Getting on throttle too hard or too early will either hinder rotation or break back end loose.

The sooner you can get this right to left transition completed, the sooner you will be in throttle and moving to the end goal. You will discover that it feels “fast” when you get this transition correctly.

More or less where you will transition to left and up.

By the time you have pointed kart left and up, your throttle will be full. If you have done it right, the weight of the karts right to left transition will settle simultaneously with 100% throttle output.

Basically, if you narrow the entrance to the toilet bowl, you are forced into a squashed S. You will be entering the right/left bit with too hard an initial right turn. You will have to lose speed to rotate it around. So don’t do that. Come in from below more.

Green represents what I mean by coming in more from below as opposed to red which hugs inside more. Not intended to show ideal line or anything, just the idea.

image Look at the rubber. A is where I’d recommend trying to hold throttle to before releasing. Note that your turn in is under power. Still accelerating! Red shows peril of too shallow. Green illustrates up + out.

I stumbled upon a line last night where it was one piece. Full throttle from turn in all the way to turn 4. So it’s possible.

Best advice would be to moderate your speed so that you clip apex of 8, ride out all the way left, have a strong run down from left side, and hold throttle longer than you think.

Then toss it at next apex, don’t brake, roll. Trust the roll. If you threw it in hard enough, the roll will be more than enough to get you up and into the meat of the turn. If not, try throwing it in harder next time. For now, try to figure out how to add throttle as early as possible. Just a bit to make up for your weak entrance.

One other thing that’s important. As you come over the top, you are going to roll the left side of the kart onto the left kerbing. This next bit matters: you MUST do your pre-final-turn lift BEFORE you straddle the kerb. And, you feed back in immediately as you turn and go to clip the right exit apex marker.

Look at second to last guy. He’s on the kerbing at wide point and likely just pushing into throttle here to zoom out. The guy behind him is probably about to lift and turn down.

This allows you to get an exit onto the straight that is shallower. You are earlier to power, basically. The lift allows the better rotation. The only exception to this lift before you get to kerb rule is if you happen to stumble upon that perfect line I described earlier. No lift for that one, your angle is perfect and you’ll be full throttle already.

Edit: now that I’ve made that point, it’s not strictly true. Look at Alan’s fast lap and my fastest. In both cases we’re a bit delayed.

The point of getting that “pause” out of the way earlier is to get a good angle down that doesn’t require avoiding the wall (too deep). Whatever works, really, but as a general rule, what I said should help if you are struggling to exit powerfully.

Finally: if you want to break 59, you have to learn the basics of this turn. If you want to break 58, you need to get either the first or second half of this complex right. If you want to break 57, you need to get both parts right. I’ll let you know what breaking 56 requires!

Closing thought: If you are struggling with the complex, despair not. What will eventually happen is you will “see” it as you pick up on the little pieces.

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Nice Alan!!! :checkered_flag::checkered_flag::checkered_flag::joy::joy: Sub 56 is impressive!

That was almost perfect. I wonder what you shave off from there?

Looks like the left right transition in the final bit had a tiny pause. Other than that, I couldn’t find anything to critique. Maybe the 2nd smaller 180 was a bit off? The subsequent 6-7 was badass. You gave up speed going in beautifully to nail it out. I also love how you pre-rotate the back of the kart into the turn in under bridge. Nice powerful drive out.

Edit: maybe you can hold throttle a touch longer before braking into 4? Didn’t hear bounce off limiter. Then again I stink at that turn.

Ain’t me, I am just 56.6 atm but only just started playing :slight_smile: Should have made it clear.

Aww man thought you smoked me. Prolly that French guy? I need to catch him. Edit: a word

Some guy did a 54 but I am 90% sure he cut a corner somewhere.

This is the guys set up who did the 55.7

Chassis Sodi

Yah I’m using his CRG setup for PFI. Or maybe I screwed up and am using his sodi setup on a CRG. Either way…

Also, given that the entirety of sector 1 up to turn in for 4 can be done with zero braking, a full second faster in s1 just ain’t possible.
In fact, technically, you only have to brake for 4 and 5. The rest can be punched through full throttle (but not well).

Did you write all that?

Anyway note that the picture you showed on the track from above.


You can see the racing line on the rubber and its a mixture of both. Red on entry then a tight turn to the green.

Same with the second photo.


You can clearly see the rubber has the kart partly up the kerb.

@NikG Yup. I reworked it.

Agreed. The lines are to describe the perils of being too shallow in your approach.

I don’t think you can effectively loop it around in sim if you are not opening up the entry somewhat by coming in a bit lower. Too much holding of the inside line requires a big direction change, all at once, which slows you down.

Re: Kart halfway on kerb: Yes. Don’t understand if agreeing or disagreeing. It’s pretty critical to getting width through final turn.

So big edit time:

What I wrote above isn’t wrong but it’s too restrictive.

Reality is that there are multiple ways to approach the entry to this turn, and, multiple ways out.

For example, @NikG’s method of holding the inside kerbing works just fine and is plenty quick. My method of separating from kerb at end to open the entry works too. Something in between works also. Over the course of the past couple days I’ve tried lots of variations, and there’s no one right way.

I think maybe the way to think about this complex is that it’s 2 pieces. There’s the first half which involves hooking it around and up. Then there’s the 2nd part that involves coming down and shooting out.

The first part determines your trajectory into the closing bit. Your arc coming up out of the direction change at 10 can be steep, shallow, or in between.

How you then take the closing corner depends on your angle of descent (and rate of speed) into it.

So, what I wrote before about lifting prior to the kerbing is indeed true, if that’s what your trajectory dictates. But, I have experienced very quick exits that have no lift, or a later lift.

It all depends on where you need to briefly reduce throttle to facilitate the turn onto the straight. (If at all).

For example, a very flat and low trajectory up and around will likely result in a slight lift just prior to the right exit kerb and a very flat exit. The version I described involves a higher and rounder dive down into final turn and a bigger, earlier lift to get the nose pointed at the exit.

I guess what is important to understand, if you are new to this corner, is that flow is important. You need to learn to roll speed up into the complex, and you need to ASAP change direction, while trying to keep as much of that momentum as possible.

Then, the important next bit is turning that momentum into something you can send down the straight as fast as possible.

How you do this can vary. So try different things.

What I wrote is a start.